The Infantry Is Dead (For Now)

Greetings Me Droogs N Droogettes!
Yep. Deader than Kelsey’s Nuts man. Hate to say it, but in the current day iteration, the Infantry as it is is no longer a viable battlefield element the way it used to be.

A proud heritage that dates back to when Grugg organized a group of guys with clubs, and used them to take over another groups cave and hold that ground. I’m a proud Member of that Brotherhood.

In its current form, it just is no longer a viable force as it is. If anything, the Krainian Klown show is a prime example of the need for the Infantry to evolve. It’s going to have to go more technical/mechanical if you will, as right now? The current day protective gear just isn’t enough to keep up with the advancements of the ISR.

We’ve all been watching the videos.
In fact, I got a sinking feeling during the Armenia–Azerbaijan border crisis back in 202/21. That was one of the first time we saw, in real time, drones having a direct net effect against scores of Infantry in the open so to speak. When I saw my first video in shitty 480p of a platoon of Armenian Infantry walking down what was supposed to be a ‘safe road’ and getting first spotted by the drone, then lased by the drone, and then getting utterly obliterated by the Artillery that was called in by the drone.

Now, even in the short jump in tech, we’ve seen drones completely come to dominate the ISR (intelligence/surveillance/reconnaissance) field of battle… hell, not only are the drones performing recon/seeking and peeking but also as offensive weapons? Despite the naysayers of hobbyist Drone Folks, let me tell you, just because it looks like and/or your in your civilian experience that a drone can NOT carry a load large enough to be offensive?

Man, there’s a metric fucktonnage of wrecked rooskie and krainian vehicles out there that’d like to have a word with you.

I mean I even tried to do an explanation of that video showing them strapping the RPG ‘cone of destruction’ to the sports drone, and still I got people telling me that “…There’s no way it could carry that in that configuration/with that battery/in my experience.” Let me ask you:

That the section in question, when primed correctly, weighs in at less than a pound. And that when it hits a target it is capable of punching through up to 30 inches of rolled homogenous steel.

So yeah.
Drones are cool, but totally suck to a grunt. The videos of drones dropping small fragmentation weapons? Mostly (from the look of it) 50mm in size. The Russians (and Krainians) have a weird sizing in their mortars, unlike the rest of the world who uses 60mm and 81mm, they use 50 and 82mm. In fact they show them dropping them on guys… at night, during the day… in bunkers, walking… you name it… Both sides, AFU and Rus…

There’s one cool-but-fucked-up video of a Tank, not sure on who’s side (T-64 so maybe Krainian) with it’s turret main hatch (TC Hatch specifically) open, and the drone drops what appears to be a 50mm Mortar round with “nothin’ but net” through the open turret, whereupon it detonated inside and kil’t the crew… NO one got out of that BTW… the tank, because of the way the autoloader works, the tank ‘brewed up’ like a motherfucker about 20 seconds after the hit and the flames almost took out the drone.

Another fucked up vidya (IMO) was of a Russian Soldier on the shitter, under a camo-net and poncho who got smoked taking a dump…(not cool man, let a brother at least finish his shit Aye?) So far, drones have had to stick to smaller ordinance, unless it’s a specific-built drone like the Lancet and such… 82mm still have to be dropped conventionally….

In fact, an 82mm mortar round is what took out my house in September of 2004. Waitaminute… Holy SHIT!!! I went to look for and found the pic of my house being blown away… found it too:

That’s the Grin of a Lucky far Thinner Motherfucker…

MomUnit said I -always- get out by the skin of my ass…
Cue the Indiana Jones Theme Song….

The round came in, blew through the wall of the trailer, and detonated. I’m standing on the edge of a HUGE hole in the floor and you can see the wall and roof… 82mm sucks man. But the Holy Shit factor was I wanted to check exactly what day it was, as I knew it was September so I checked the pic properties:

Sweet Jesus!
19 Years ago to THE DAY
Reason this’s a BIG DEAL to me was I went in to work 15 minutes early that particular day… I was pissed off at the Office Supervisor who was NOT my boss but thought he was and was always bitching that I was exactly on time, and never early.
Hey, I was a contractor… If I’m not getting paid, I ain’t working, Iraq or No fucking Iraq…


I got the call when I was driving around ‘cos they were sifting through the rest of the wreckage… you can’t see it in the pics but there were two 2.5 gallon jugs of ketchup in the room that got blow’d the fuck up, and spattered ALLLLL over the opposite wall to where I’m standing… VERY gruesome and I didn’t get a pic ‘cos, well… I wasn’t ‘all there’ mentally at the time so they (all my co-workers/neighbors and the rescue QRF team) thought I had been set to “juicy mode”…

When the round hit, I would have been standing exactly in front of that wall locker getting ready IF I had been on schedule. That’s some seriously big pieces of shrapnel that done punched thru that door… at some point I’ll explain the whole story -why- I had 5 gallons of Ketchup in the crib…. long story short? I used to make the best home-made BBQ sauce…

Back to the point… sorry about that, got a bit weirded by the fact that it’s the 2nd B-Day so to speak… Anyways, unless there’s a serious dynamic shift to some ‘new tech’ a’la Heinlein’s “Starship Troopers” i.e. Mobile Armor Suits that can protect a user up to and including ‘pee-wee nukes’, then Modern Infantry doesn’t stand a chance on the modern battlespace.

In battle, the job of the Infantry is to take and hold space in conjunction with the other Combined Arms elements. Artillery does the ‘pre game softening up’ and Tanks, for the most part, do the performative part of the “Blitzkrieg” so to speak, and ‘break the lines’ which then allows the Infantry to follow through and take and hold (theoretically) the terrain that the tanks just opened up. Because of the ‘new evolution’ in unmanned indirect and direct fire capabilities, the Modern Day Infantryman, much like in the Days of Passchendaele and the Somme, is seriously unable to protect themselves.

Let’s face it, a Level IV plate or Helmet ain’t worth fuck-all if you step on a mine, or if a ‘ka-boomy-boom’ (big OR small) gets dropped on you from above. ESPECIALLY since it appears that the Arty these days has gone from “To Whom it May Concern” to “An Offer Specifically Made For YOU!”

Like that vidya a Posted a ways back of that “small drone swarm attack” on a platoon of Krainians BTW has been confirmed… 4 guys smoked by individual drones that targeted them specifically and blew up with less than a quart pound of RDX with ball bearings in the drone… a flying “Death Claymore” of sorts…

Makes me happy AF not to be a grunt anymore.

Soooo many videos out there. Not even going to try and touch on one in particular. Fact is, 90% of dead, on both sides in all the videos I’ve seen, of the grunts, they were taken out via indirect fire. Dead stacked in windrows… Mines have also played hell, especially on the Krainian side which has been doing what’s called “Meat Assaults” on hardened pre-registered defensive lines that have the ever living fuck mined out of them. Despite what -some- have said about the “Glorious Counter Offensive”… well… it ain’t doing so hot….

The itty-bitty Deep Blue sections at the top are the ‘AFU Breakthroughs’. Now, Granted the sourcing is a VERY pro-Russian site, but my thought process is this:

If the Krainians were doing extraordinarily well as all the Cheerleaders said that they would, well then where’s all the pictures of the vast breakthroughs? Pics of piles of Russian Dead and/or POWs? Pics of the maps of the serious advances? Where’s the pictures of the victorious Krainians standing on top of the ‘dragon’s teeth’? Sort of like this from the Siegfried Line in Germany back in WW2?

‘Cos there ain’t none.

THIS is ONE OF the Russian MLR (Main Line of Resistance) the “Surovikin Line” under construction last winter:

From my looking at this, there 3 rows of teeth, and then what looks like a positively HUGE amount of pickets and barbed wire/concertina, and then in the distance another line (or three) of MORE dragon’s teeth. The satellite pics show this motherfucker extends hundreds of miles in each direction. The Russians actually had civilian construction companies augment the building of this as they didn’t have enough Army Engineers available.

Any bets that in between rows its pure-dee mined like a motherfucker?

And this is just one of three rows like this according to OUR OWN satellite data? As in this’s Defensive Line ONE, followed a few kliks back by a duplicate that’s Defensive Line TWO, followed lastly by Defensive Line THREE.

Yeah, they ain’t breaking through shytte IMO.
In fact, Here’s The Krainian OSINT Map of their “GAINZZZZZ!”

Yeah… not mucho better Aye?

And no, I’m not ‘gargling Putins junk’ here as some commentators have stated. This is a basic for-real fact. Sat-Data don’t lie. I don’t consider the ONE picture of a Krainian Flag on the blown out ruin of a house in a town that had only 40 houses to begin with a “Major Blow to the Invader”… Especially since then? The Ivans took it back. We’re also NOW seeing it in the various Ministries of Propaganda and Lies that, well, it ain’t going so well… Case in Point? Watch this from the BBC, the BIGGEST cheerleaders normally…

That’s a lot of fresh graves……………
Sad about the chick…….
She’s cute
What a waste……

No amount of hating Russia is going to change the very basic facts that the Russians, backwards or not, have a 5 to 1 population advantage (military aged males) available. The whole “Russians fled by the millions” to the EU doesn’t play. My embassy friend(s) (Jarhead Guards) said the BIGGEST problem right now are Krainians positively flooding the US Embassies in Deutschland trying like fuck to get here to the States as Germany, according to their newspaper Das Bilt, the German government is going to allow the extradition of Krainian College students and any walking talking Krainian motherfucker who can carry a rifle but ‘got gone’ when shit got real to fill the now-utterly-depleted ranks.

The very fact that they’ve openly said that they’re now inducting the lazy, lame and mentally ill? Oh yeah… they’ll be taking the Crimea back any day now.

And the Brits Wunderwaffen?
Them “Big Game Changer” Challenger 2s?
From Vox Day:

That was written by Colonel Hamish de Bretton-Gordon, a former Commanding Officer of the 1st Royal Tank Regiment.

Someone better drug test the Colonel…

That’s a blown out and burning Challenger 2. And the video was shot by a Krainian driving by while trying to get a buddy to the medics…that’s a still of it.

Ivan then confirmed the kill (along with a bunch of ‘other’ vehicles via drone…

Somehow I don’t think anyone got out of that one…
Because up til now, the Brits hitting their collective Hopium Bong, thought that their ‘Superior British Armor and Industry’ was going to carry the day. To them, the failure of the Leopard 2 was because of “inferior German engineering ay wot?”

This from a country who, while making some really pretty cars over the past few years, generally, mechanically speaking, they’re fucking turds. Historically they make an OK tank… the Churchill being one. Otherwise, they relied on the M-4 Sherman and the M-3 Lee, but calling it the Grant for whatever reason. BOTH American made and designed.

Guess they’re going to have to start switching to smoking “Copium” in the bong now that the Hopium ain’t working.

Even on casualties, the numbers, be it 70000 KIA as the US Claims or 400000 KIA as others claim, what utterly kills me is that the supposition that the original 500000 man army that the Krain started with still exists AT ALL. Far too many people have said “Well they have/had half a million people in the AFU to start with!!! There’s no way they had 400000 KIA!!!” “Only 70k KIA means they still have 330k to fight! (not including the 50k amputees that we know about mind you)”


For the past 1 year, 6 months, 14 days the war has been poppin’.
How many times have we heard about the Krainians raising ANOTHER Army?

Last I heard, THIS build up was Number Three.

If this’s their THIRD army, then what the fuck happened to the other two!?! Suffice it to say, from all legitimate sourcing, they were fucking decimated in reverse.

Decimation is defined as “One out of Ten Killed”

Considering a HUGE number of interviews with both AFU Prisoners as well as front-line veterans who got seriously fucked up (missing limbs/blind) and came back have all reported that it’s almost Nine out of Ten that were, have been, and are still being killed in action at the front.

Did the Russians take massive casualties themselves?
Especially in Bahkmut. 30k+ Russians I heard.

HOWEVER the majority of them were Wagner. Prisoners and such… not a big net loss on the books so to speak for the Russians. Word is after Bahkmut, the amount of “Professional Soldiers” KIA’d was around 5k+/-. That includes almost the entire Brigade of Spec-Ops Airborne guys who were supposed to take the Airport, but got seriously fucked up by the Rear Echelon Krainians who were there. Can NOT deny that the Krainians can and have fought like demented Berserker Motherfuckers…

Since then? Not sure, but I’m damned sure that they, the Russians haven’t lost anywhere near as many as the Krainians have. In fact the whole “fighting like ever-lovin’ bastards” is part of their (the Krains) problem… too willing to ‘charge into the teeth’ of the machine guns early on….

So, as I was saying, because of the Krainian lack of Close Air Support (critical for Combine Arms Combat) a serious lack of Air Support (I think they have like 12 Migs left at last count), a lack of Artillery (no more shells) an absolute metric fuckton of landmines with them NOT having any -significant- mine clearing capability any more, and the ISR/Indirect/Direct Fire Capabilities of the drones, all combine to essentially eliminate any real and decent threat they have to the Russians. They’re running out of bodies point period fucking dot.

Especially since the Russians have all the time in the world. The longer this stretches, the worse it’s going to be for them. Whether you want to believe it or not, sure, Ivan is using T-55s…but HOW they’re using them?

Let us not forget THAT particular surprise

I -still- laugh every. time. I. see. it.
I mean honestly, the Krainians sort of did it to themselves, hitting it somewhat prematurely and detonating it with that RPG… didn’t matter though, that overpressure wave kil’t EVERYONE in the blast cone I’m sure. A Made-In-1955 Tank, given a new engine, and utterly packed to the gills with EXTREMELY High Explosives (judging from that Boom, Erf Shattering, Type One Each, HUGE) and given a basic remote control and/or “lock the gears and jump out” gives the whole “…Go that way, very fast, if something gets in your way, explode violently.” a new meaning of ‘doing moar with less.’

And the Russians have how many? that ‘can be renovated to be used as mobile Tank-Bombs’? Again, Go to “Abandoned Spaces” and check that out HERE

And for all the naysayers out there who’ll try and use the “…but they’re rusted out scrap!!!”…

Let me ask you this: Which is easier? Having to build, from scratch, a tank hull/turret, as in completely fabricate the metal from blanks and/or pour the liquid steel? Build the engines from scratch or rebuild them from the pile of pulled power packs? (pics in the link)


Go out to a place like this (of which according to some sources there’s about 35 similar ‘caches’ all over Russia) and pick and choose the least rusty, least damaged, can-be-sanded-repainted and rebuilt in a quarter of the time than building a new tank from scratch?

I can tell you:
According to stats, Refurbishing a T-72 completely takes 800 man-hours or about 45 days. COMPLETELY
Building a new one? Not sure… no real info.

However, Refurbishing a M1 Abrams? It takes 18 to 24 months IF all goes well. That’s from stripping it down to its base components, and redoing the whole thing. They have NOT made a NEW-NEW M1 Chassis since January of 1985 when the last one came down the assembly line in Ohio.

And some of them?
Wellllllll… let’s just say they can’t rebuild/refurb some of them.

I know of what I speak… it’s probably how I got the lung cancer:

Those are soooo radiologically fucked up from the Chobham being broken open/burned open… In fact the reason I took these pictures is because when I asked the DotMil about the danger of the possibility of radiation, I got blown off, and then I found some bullshit paperwork stating that the tanks had been and I quote “…Triple Wrapped in protective plastic to minimize the possibility of radiologic contamination from exposure to the elements.”

My speckled ass.
They look wrapped to you?
I’ve ranted enough for now. needless to say, unless there’s an absolute paradigm shift in personal armoring, i.e. Mobile Mecha/Gundam/Mobile Infantry ‘Marauder Suits’ then the Infantry is going to be damned near finished in it’s traditional role.
More Later
Big Country

This’s the hat I had that survived the Mortar attack. It was IN the house. It still has itty-bitty pieces of shrapnel imbedded in the brim, hence some of the rust stains. When I cash in, I want to be buried in it… and Yeah, I still wear it…

59 thoughts on “The Infantry Is Dead (For Now)”

  1. I guess no one reads history anymore? if you remember the battle of Kursk ? the Russians put in something like 4-6 thousand mines per klick ? something they learned how to do from the Germans. I remember reading that a whole company of the 28 inf division vanish when attacking the West wall. they didn’t even find bits enough to bury. let alone name the bits.
    as you know, minefields should be covered by direct fire in order to “work” at their best.
    I guessing that drones are doing that now ? scary shit.
    and BTW, Ivan has always loved him some arty. if it wasn’t for lend lease trucks, they never would have moved as fast as they did in 44. one duce and one gun. and we sent over 400,000 trucks back then. you should check out war factories on Youtube. good series on how the war was won. as for the tank bomb, why not from their point of view. the tanks are doing anything but rusting away, so why not make them into a serious mobile bomb ?
    and I don’t think anyone lived thru THAT blast wave either. the over pressure would kill them.
    so, I think your right about being a grunt these days. not a good thing.

    1. The 28th did not land until after D-Day in France, you must mean the 29th Division. I met some of the survivors of the D-Day invasion from the 29th Division. They were from the 3rd wave, very late in the day.

      1. I thought it was the 28th was the bloody bucket div, might be the 29th. when attacking the west wall lost a hell of a lot of people. one company was wiped out to a man. they couldn’t even find bits enough to say who or what it was. between the minefields and machine guns a lot of them just are gone
        then the Germans hit them with mortars to finish the job.
        they really earned that name though. bloody bucket Div. I think they had the “record” for
        people either wounded or killed in WW2. kind of what market-garden was to get around.
        funny thing about that. they never asked the Dutch military about it. there is a record of a Dutch officer telling them they where doing the attack wrong. as they had war gamed it out BEFORE the war at their war school back in the 1930’s. I remember reading that in the book the bridge too far.

  2. Don’t reckon infantry is dead so much as will need a hell of a lot more support from other arms, especially combat engineering to harden positions and breach obstacles.
    The infantry moving to contact, doing recon etc. will need some serious rethinking, but end of the day still need to capture and hold the dirt.

    1. well thats the gist of this article… an ENTIRELY NEW WAY is now needed.
      Drones just, for the most part, eliminated “Sneeking and Peeking”
      And imagine the quantum leap if they get -smaller-… like bug-sized that can and will get inside a target for intel/recon/targeting?
      Like the changes are sooooo different from when I was a ground-pounder… A good ghillie, properly done makeup, and a s-l-o-w crawl was all you needed.
      These days? Thermal’ll give you away all. day. long.
      Day OR Night
      Hence the need for a paradigm shift.

      1. Suppose the other aspect to it is we’re got to start thinking how these things are going to be used by cops and other enforcement agencies. Look at some of the co-ordinated displays the chinks are using AI to do, and some of the rumors I’ve seen on how autonomous the Russian drones are in target ID, got to wonder how far we are off drones automatically enforcing traffic violations and small petty shit like that. We’re only a hop and a skip from robocop/judge dredd dystopian type use of drones.

      2. Agree … I’m wondering thinking that it may develop more ‘sniper/stealth’ type of TTPs, garb, etc… ir suppressant or hidden, camouflaged, and more stealth movement, or hidden. Definitely more tech savvy, launch your drone or two instead of hauling a barret around…

        1. Whoop! There it is!, You’re on point brother. I have been saying this for a long time. You can shitblast Orcs and Goblins all day long, start targeting Central Command and you will start getting somethin done.

  3. Good article BCE and you are discussing a paradigm shift.
    The crappy thing about paradigm shifts in military technology is that people are slow to recognize it and many will even fight it. Meanwhile a bunch of poor SOBs end up getting killed.
    Some paradigm shifts in the last centuries:
    * The power of artillery – ask the Scots at the Battle of Culloden where the English cannon wiped the Highlanders out.
    * The rifled musket – Civil War generals stilled used Napoleonic tactics to march in formation and charge when within 50 yards (a musket range). Instead rifled muskets along with artillery were wiping out the oncoming troops.
    * The machine gun – WWI troops quickly learned the futility of charging into a crew served machine gun.
    * Aircraft Carriers vs Battleships – before WWII battleship admirals believed it was impossible for aircraft to sink a battleship. Ask the BBs Prince of Wales and Repulse about that.
    * Tanks – The Germans used tanks as an offensive weapon to break out and get behind the enemy lines. The French had good tanks but used them as infantry support.

  4. Love the hat. (Ihatealeg.)

    Drones, aircraft with thermal, FLIR, etc.. are great, but terrain dependent. In thick woodlands, FLIR is not very useful. We have been fighting in open non-wooded terrain, and it shows.

    In teh Krain, they have the steppe interspersed with woodlands. Great, except Ivan knows that the Uki’s are hidin’ in the woods. Bad juju. (Like the bomb tank video and arty -BM-27, etc…)

    Where I live the woods are so thick that FLIR can’t penetrate. Still Queen of Battle here.
    So far…

    1. Live action E&E going on in my neck of the woods for the past 8 days now. Local, State and Federales using all to find 1 escaped con. Flir equipped helos plus at least one fixed wing asset with a dome on top. Drones, dogs, horse back, ATVs and foot patrols along with road closures, all to keep him in a now eight sq. mile box and he still keeps running and they have to keep moving the box. Terrain mixed heavy woodlands, corn fields, expensive secluded housing clusters. Sightings are at night on trail cams and doorbell cams ,but by the time they get the info he’s gone. Google Longwood Gardens for the location and aerial map. Oh and the Feds are concerned as it is just up the road from Sleepy Joe’s Delaware home. If we study the response we can plan accordingly for the future.

      1. I live in the area, too. Amused that it has gone on so long, but keep my garage door closed now unless I’m there working in it.

  5. For the people who repeatedly claim that “we cannot have an effective drone less than the Predator in size”, I’ll note the switchblade. It’s all of 5 pounds in weight, and can attack non-armored targets. To attack the tanks, there is theswitchblade 600 at twice the weight.

    The point is that these are not some highly classified devices produced at a high tech DOD company. Hobbyist drones had the capability first, before the DOD saw soldiers playing with them off-duty and decided to adapt them. And our enemies can easily adapt the same devices.

  6. It was probably 10-12 years ago, when government was deciding to require registration of hobby drones, when DARPA was bragging that they had created a handheld EMP device designed to knock drones out of the sky. There was even a video of it on youtube. It was supposed to be designed for airport security. It looked like one of those handheld bionic ear things you used to see for sale in the back of magazines in the ’80’s.

    Seems there should be some way for Infantry to neutralize the drones, if such a device exists or was DARPA blowing smoke up everyone’s ass? A battlefield EMP device would be the way to do it.

    1. I think the anti-drone guns you speak of are really radios operating on the same frequency as the target drone. They essentially overwhelm the control signal from the drone operator with the yagi directional antenna. The concentrated signal from the yagi is stronger than the remote signal from the drone control console. Most drones now have a fail safe mode that will cause an auto return to the launch location if the control signal is lost. Older drones would just land wherever they were when the signal was lost/jammed. This is my understanding of how these commercially available drones and anti-drone “guns” work. I’m certainly no expert, but if this is more or less accurate, then the basis of an anti drone air guard team already exists in your signals collection section. The radio signal is just as vulnerable to detection, interception, jamming , and maybe even hijacking as is any other radio based system
      I would think that most off the shelf drones probably operate in a known range of frequencies, and the operator is broadcasting when he launches the drone just the same way anyone with a transmitter is broadcasting when they key the mic to talk. I would expect to see a greater emphasis in identifying hostile drone signals, countering them on that frequency, AND simultaneously engaging the location where that signal originated from.
      I have no real issue with you BCE as far as your observations go, but I would point out as others have here that the Eurasian steppes that are 90% agricultural fields and 3% “wooded” are hardly forests in my eyes. When shelled for a period of time they are not much more then scrub vegetation. I would be very surprised if drones were as effective against moving infantry in most dense woodlands, and I seriously doubt they would be much use at all in triple canopy jungle as found in Vietnam. I also think both sides in this war do a rather poor job of camoflaging their earthworks from aerial observation. We used to dig up living sod in sheets like the rolls of turf they sell at Home Depot and cover our fighting positions with it of grass was prominent in our defensive location. If deeper in the woods, the fallen forest duff was used copiously. I can see the yellow digging spoils around the trenches very clearly in all these drone kill videos coming out of the Kraine. It speaks to me of laziness and inexperience that I would have expected them to have figured out by now.

      1. One of the important unrecognized uses of drones is overflying your own positions looking for gaps in camouflage coverage (both visual and thermal)

      2. Durn good observations, Mike, about the laziness of digging trenches –leaving the yellow clay “spoil” round about said trench.

        May as well have painted a bullseye in red on the trench locale.

        Those old drones, “eyes in the sky,” have two words: “NO MERCY!”

    2. The Electronics in a small Drone cannot be Shielded, due to Weight Limitations. So I would suspect that a very High-Power Microwave (Radar) Jammer, like is used on EW Aircraft, would be more useful and effective. With a Directional Antenna and 10’s of Kilowatts on the Amplifier, a Microwave Beam would likely just Fry the Circuits in a small Drone. I know from working in Commercial Aviation, that High-Power Radar Sets are Not to be Messed with (or stood in front of).

      Could a ‘Hand-Held’ device work this way? Depends on the ability to Pulse the Transmitter at a high Loading; It might take a very Narrow Beam and possibly changing Batteries after a few ‘Shots’, but I don’t see it as ‘Impossible’.

      As for the changing effectiveness of Grunts, Everything on the Ground MUST have Air Support, and if the numerous Vids of Tanks and Trucks and Grunts getting Shelled “out of the Blue” from a Recon Drone are any example, it looks like the use of Drones for Art’y Spotting is extremely Effective. The Bear has Air Superiority, therefore the Bear Kicks Ass.

    3. It’s not an EMP gun. It’s a radio receiver & transmitter hooked to a computer running some software. The software “listens” for drone transmissions. When it finds one it looks in its drone signal recognition database to identify it. Once that’s done it looks at its ECM database for countermeasures effective against that particular class of drone.

      Usually it gives the gun operator a choice of soft kill and hard kill options. The soft kill option just sends the drone the “auto land” commands to make it land RTF now. Depending on the target it may be a command sequence or it could be a specific set of countermeasure(s) that make the drone think it has a potentially catastrophic failure in its systems somewhere and that landing immediately is the safest option.

      The hard kill option sends the drone command sequences designed to crash and/or permanently damage the drone. Some of the Drone guns just jam the link between the base station and the drone. Depending on the drone model it may auto land or crash when it loses contact with the operator.

  7. I watch the videos of dudes getting killed and never seeing it coming from drone stuff and that makes me cringe. Doesn’t hardly seem fair but fair has nothing to do with it I guess.

  8. The thick forest at night video with people clearly standing out due to infrared heat signature is the sum it all up video.
    All sides should know that there is no stealth without hiding the heat signature, maybe a space blanket over a rabbit hole?
    Fires at night are not recommended either.
    There are no combined arms for the Ukes and the plan is to depopulate anyway to make way for Greater Israel.
    They don’t give a rip about the people who live there.
    Wunderwaffen need operators and people to train the operators and you can ask the Germans if the waffen of wunder will win the WAR.
    We are seeing the beginnings of Terminator mech war in the Kraine but for now troops still have to capture and hold territory.

    1. I played with a work flir system. A wet wool blanket suspended in 4feet front of a propane torch blocked the heat signature of the fire.

      1. Good to know…shit’s gonna fly here stateside sooner rather than later. One-up the thermal boyz in the chopper or drones.

        1. Assume military is 2 steps better than civy stuff to be safe. I figured out a wet (not damp) wool blanket over a tunnel mouth will hide it from flir based on my expiriments. The blanket if too close to fire gets too warm, hence the 4ft from my tests. Could be closer for a person vs propane torch.

          The unit i tested with back in 2011 was so advanced to buy it required vetting by the gov and an agreement not to export it or loan it to non citizens. The basic civy models now are just as good as that was 12 years ago… hence why i assume military is better now.

          There was a doctor who did a study back then too on finding breast cancer with the ir camera months sooner than a mamagram could.

          We used it to find cracks in the refractory lining of dessicant towers without removing the dessicant. Saved tons of $$ in the 1st year.

      2. For how long? 15 minutes is pointless. 4 hours is a good start. And no, it won’t dissipate the heat signature that long – and if it did, it would show up as a cold spot, which is almost as observable. It has to stand up for *days* to be of actual use to the untrained grunts on the line.

  9. I prefer to choose the battle space if I can , and it’s the mountains with their deep canopy. Fuck flatland fighting , you might as well sign up as the turkey in that shoot. Dead ground is my fren!

  10. Just so you know, the M3 Lee/Grant thingy…

    The M3 Lee had a turret with the 37mm and a turret on top with two .30 cal mgs. Radio in the hull. With an almost dedicated radio operator (co-driver.)

    The M3 Grant replaced the double turret and introduced a larger turret for the 37mm with coax .30 cal and radio in the turret. Why? Because the Brits asked for it. Radio next to the commander in the turret rather than way below in the hull like the Lee had.

    Other than that, it was a good stop-gap vehicle in either variation. Got the big 75mm gun on a mobile platform before most other nations could mount an equivalent gun on anything. And it also gave American industry the chance to learn how to make big armor, and to equip the lines and build the infrastructure to manufacture the M4 Sherman.

    Other than that, yeah, drones have totally changed the battlefield. Totally. And they’re getting more and more advanced every year, fuck, every month. Which happens with ‘new tech’ in war time. You can’t stick with what you started with, you have to advance.

    It’s gotten so bad with the drones that every 4th trooper should be armed with a semi-auto shotgun with a 24-28 inch barrel for shooting the damned things down.

    1. You just gave me an idear Fren…
      Have to look at working it out…on paper strictly

      Problem with a -basic- shotty is the range/distances involved. I make fireworks shells here at the house for my 37mm launcher. The way they work is I measure and cut a ‘timer fuse’ that when I fire off the round, the fuse ignites when the propellant charge goes off, the shell goes up, and when the time is right, it pops off the happy-happy Fireworks… I have a chart around here somewhere….

      IF one were to substitute the Star Burst fixins with say, a GOODLY load of #7 birdshot? Figure the dynamics vis-a-vis time from launch/distance, fuse length and whatnot, you could ostensibly make a “Drone Buster Flak Shell” that’d actually range up quite a bit -and- THEN wreck the motherfucker… dunno… I don’t have legal means to play with it, but someone out there might… It’s a hell of a lot cheaper, and probably a lot more effective too… even loading ‘proximity 40mm’ would do it as well and that tech is already out there….

      1. Ah, hmmm, using some of the decent shot-gun wads for buckshot as a base design for 3D printing, you could make reasonably effective 37mm wads without having to worry about proximity warheads and stuff.

        The questions are:

        At what range, in a battlefield situation or static line situation like trench warfare or city fighting, are drones detectable audibly and visually?

        At what range are various shot loads effective against drones?

        That’s the question. Between detecting the little bastards, how quickly can you acquire visually them and then at what range are shotgun style loads effective?

        So, once you determine at what range and how quickly you can spot the flying vampires, would you need something bigger than 12 gauge 3″ or magnum rounds?

        And now you have me thinking, with decent wadding, can you fire flechettes out of a regular shotgun without damaging said shotgun. And can you make pseudo-flechettes out of nails?
        And there are already shot load types for 37mm and 40mm launchers, albeit shot loads of rubber balls for crowd control. How much difference would it be to change out stingballs for lead balls?

        1. steel bb’s might be a better choice than lead pellets. and maybe pour some wax on top to extend the range a bit ? back in the 101st, had a old vet show up how to heat the juice of c-rat
          ham with juices and pour it over the old brass shotgun shells. pry up the cardboard disc
          and pour in the hot juice to make the shot hold together longer.
          he did knock down the flip up target at 100 meters with it though.
          without that bit, it was hard to knock down the target at 50 or was it 75 meters.
          again, that was back in 1975.

    2. “It’s gotten so bad with the drones that every 4th trooper should be armed with a semi-auto shotgun with a 24-28 inch barrel for shooting the damned things down.”

      Something like that is certainly a partial solution in the near term. A shotgun set up for goose hunting with magnum loads would do very well on most of the quadcopter type drones. You need to have someone on constant air guard with the same type of focus on the air as a Vietnam pointman had on his immediate front. There is clearly a lack of enough situational awareness in the Ukraine now when it comes to that by both sides. It is hard for regular armies to make adjustments to doctrine and issue civilian grade solutions as interim stopgap solutions. Civilian partisans may have an advantage here, being unrestrained by organizational inertia. Shotgun ammunition in various bird hunting gauges is also readily available, has a dual purpose, and is generally much cheaper then rifle ammo.

  11. BC – use your thinkin’ meat for something other than shoulder ballast. I won’t get into the technical aspects of drone payloads, telemetry requirements and data acquisition that make the hobby drone narrative a pant load. Apparently no one has the attention span for it.

    Let us try empirical thought instead: If hobby drones actually worked as viable weapons …you would have been using them years ago. Yes, they have been around that long. If they actually worked, Raytheon would be stamping them out by the thousands and sending them to the Kraine.

    If they actually worked, the Russians would be using them the same way. If they actually worked, the war would be over now. They’d have liquidated all the tanks, all the artillery and anything else that moved on the battlefield.

    Last week I busted a gut laughing at Aesop. Apparently the Ukes supposedly destroyed a whole squadron of MiG-29s and heavy bombers with “cardboard RC Airplane drones.” He was humping his keyboard in joy when I popped his balloon: “so I guess you’ll be doing victory laps in front of the Kremlin next week, eh Aesop?”

    Funny…there’s been no follow up strikes after that smashing success. Gee… I wonder why?

    Have it your way, fellas. I’d like to see these weapons and their armoured victims too. But like so much of the Uke war… I’ll bet dollars to donuts it’s just another fake and gay narrative from the usual suspects. I can see an idiot like General Aesop falling for it…but you are made of better stuff.

    1. Problem is Glen, there’s just too much vidya out there. Fact of it is, the ‘hobby drones’? Check this one on the ‘Zon: LINK Granted it lists as an Ag Drone, however, you going to tell me that a drone, capable of a ten kilo payload WOULDN’T be utilized by the DotMil?

      C’mon man. When I was in Affy in 2013, they had BIG fucking 6 armed (not armed-armed but as in 6 engines/on arms like the one linked above) helo-recon drones that were classified AF and I still have never seen them ‘publically revealed.’ The contractors who were training the SF kids using them told me they were “We could tell you details, but then we’d have to kill you, and you’re kind of cool BC!” level secret stuff regarding their capabilities…

      Don’t forget, How long did it take for the DotMil to even acknowledge the A-12/SR-71? Like what? 30 plus fucking years? Even tho they were seen allll over the place? Hell, driving Cab in High School I used to (on sloooow nights do the ‘park at the end of the runway’ like in Wayne’s World, but -right- up against the fence ont he civvie side of it… Seems an SR-71 had a maintenance issue (I found out later from a regular passenger) ‘cos I got to see that glorious bad-ass bird leap into the sky that night… and they were still MAD Secret Squirrel back then (1986)

      Figure we/they got some shit that NO ONE knows about and that BOTH the Krainians AND Ivan have jumped on with both fat feetz. THAT my Canoehead Fren is far closer to the real reality.

      1. We can’t even have a debate if we can’t define our terms. We were talking hobby drones… now we’re talking heavy lift ag drones? Not trying to be a dink, BC…but those are two very, very different animals. Details matter.

        The RPG7 HEAT grenade and the nigger-rigged drone: that looks hokey too. correct me if I’m wrong… that one relies on a shaped charge to defeat armour, right? So you’re taking off the penetrator that shapes the charge, focuses the explosion and provides the molten jet of metal that actually cracks the tank…and just using the explosive portion on the drone? Not trying to be a dink, I’m asking because I don’t know. I just don’t see that working…

        What I DO know is that every day, there’s any number of retards and morons in the mass media that will tell me that the Ukes have Russia on the run, they’ll fold any day… and the normies will believe it because they have video to prove it. Goofs like Aesop will clap with glee because they want to believe it. My question is… why do you guys want to believe this claptrap about small drones?

        Whatever. Have it your way fellas. Fill your boots and have a great Friday!

        1. Hey Glen
          No… VERY Good Question re: Shaped Charges. OPTIMALLY you want the cone to be at a nice neat 90degree flat-to-flat faced hit, however:
          MOST armor on Vehicles has a slant intentionally to help deflect as you know. That particular warhead they’re using on that drone in particular, is a late-gen designed to punch/burn thru REALLY HOTand REALLY QUICK. Therefore in that instance, hell yeah it’ll take out what they’re aiming at, in fact, (you wouldn’t know as you weren’t in my line of work) but the Armor they hit in that particular vidya? The shape/outline screamed US Supplied M113, a 1950’s APC that is fuck all about useless except as shelter for grunts from LIGHT arty shrapnel. Otherwise they’re fucking zippos man. The cone from an IED (key word IMPROVISED) is that they WORK. Ask the Haj in Iraq. Scariest shit driving down Route Irish (for me personally) was watching the curbs… the Iraqis got ‘creative’ and would put a EFP-IED (explosive force penetrator- improvised explosive device) -INSIDE- a fucking ‘fake curbstone’ made of Styrofoam, paint it up, remove a brick curbstone, and set it up to blow up a vehicle, either by way of visually (cell phone) or on a timer. So yeah.

          As far as drones, in the DotMil, there are NO hobby drones is my point. A ‘hobby’ model like the small one I’ve been fucking around with to learn how to fly them? Yeah, not so much, but I’m sure I could -probably- mount a small charge on it, and rig a impact detonator using a percussion cap… Not for nuthin’ you start getting into larger, MOAR expensive drones like the DJI Mavic at $5k? Take off and ‘trim down’ some of the hi-speed bullshit, and replace it (said aforementioned parts) with a large warhead and oops!

          And the Krain, personally I’m leaning in that they’ve lost 500k KIA. Got me a source who’s been ‘counting fresh graves’ via ‘certain recon elements’ and told me it’s FAR worse than ANYTHING we can imagine. Also, some Radio traffic from some Krainian units just plainly disappeared… like as in a 300 man Battalion about to go on the offense went from ‘being there’ to ‘radio silence’…no one ‘officially’ knows what happened… To the point now they’re NOT even recovering the dead but doing the mass-graves/hiding the stiffs/cremating ASAP to NOT let the public know, and protests/questions about missing loved ones are NOT allowed by the Nazis… ask the wrong question and off to the front lines for you, male or female…

          As far as believing what you call ‘claptrap’ well, I’ve SEEN things that civvies have NOT nor are ALLOWED to see… so there it is…TTYL!

          1. We won’t know anything for sure until we see the drones in use, start to finish, close up. If you have a small drone…perfect! Prove it too yourself! Check my methodology?

            Here’s what I did when this flap started: I have a fairly powerful 7 or 8 inch drone I built with low KV high torque motors – for lifting. At the time the faggotry were all screaming that not only could little drones like mine drop grenades on the hapless squaddies below – they could lift heavy tank busters and take out armoured planes and vehicles.

            I looked on the internet and found that the standard NATO baseball grenade weighed 0.67 kg. I am not allowed to play with grenades (can’t imagine why)…so I simulated the weight payload with 670 grams worth of 223 ammo in a Dillon Tupperware ammo box. My drone wouldn’t even lift it or get off the ground. I was (and am) convinced that multirotors this small will not lift a grenade sized explosive. Sure you can bugger around with props and motors but you will not vastly improve your payload by much. If you did…it sure as hell wouldn’t fly well. Can you try this experiment with yours?

            I foolishly terminated the experiment and lost interest. What I should have done is lightened the payload until it DID fly… but my shithouse estimate is that the thing *MIGHT* fly with a payload about half that of the grenade. My question to you is this: can you give me a tank buster that will open up armour with a 335 gram total weight?

            This is off topic but related, I suppose. The Usual Suspects told me (and I believed it) that the Javelin missile system made the tank obsolete. I am now doubting that…I have seen the Russian warehouses stacked to the rafters with captured Javs, and the Ukes were throwing them away in the field. I heard some nonsense that the batteries were no good…but swapping batteries or nigger-rigging a new power cell can’t be a big deal I would think?

            How small can you go and still bust a tank?

          2. Dude, AWESOME info.
            LOVE the give and take. Wish you were here to do a podcast. Have to talk via DM… THAT would be epic. Get Aesop in there to be “monkey in the middle”. As to your question “How small can you go and still bust a tank?”
            I’m going to have to do a full poast on that.
            Make that tomorrows subject, from both MY personal experience(s) as well as the regular word-of-mouth intel I have.
            Look at it this way, depends on what your definition of “bust” is… as in “Blown the fuck open/piece parts scattered to RMTPs” or “Blow’d up enough to render Inoperative” or “Cause enough Damage that the crew bails”? (RMTP = Rapidly Moving Tank Parts)
            Oh, and BTW, the first couple of rounds (iterations) of the Jav, OMFG GREAT weapon… damned near put us TOW guys out of work for a while (moar in the poast tomorrow) As far as later? LOTS of QC issues from what I’ve heard… they got lazy from the sound of it what with the muh diversity hires post war.
            Let me know!

        2. The front cone of an RPG warhead is hollow. On inpact it does mushroom and provides something akin to a “gasket” for the important parts of the RPG warhead, all located in the rear cone: the copper penetrator and the cone-shaped explosive charge. The front cone (which is not the penetrator) does not shape the charge, it is already shaped. So, an RPG warhead with front cone removed would easily still work dropped vertically on a flat target.

      2. Isn’t the answer even larger scale electronic warfare to confuse or destabilize the drones, maybe sending them back against their own side? Taking potshots at them can’t be more than a very partial answer, which could be dealt with by drone swarms…

  12. Drones can operate at heights way above anything hand portable has a prayer of reaching them, even a ma duce. There is only one way to deal with them, and that is EW, and that, my friends, is where the Army is in a real pickle, as organic EW assets for Big Green are a bit thin on the ground.

    Russia has had a graduate level course on battlefield EW since Chechnya, and now over a year of operational experience of tactical drone use down to the small unit level. I haven’t heard a word about anything going on with the Army on how to counter widespread use of drones for battlefield recon, and I *highly* doubt that the Army practices operating under the assumption that they are both under drone observation and at risk of precision artillery strikes at all times.

    Army needs a tracked medium gun platform right freaking now, something in the 40-57mm range that can knock drones out of the sky up to a decent height with airburst munitions. A lot of them. Sure would be nice to have a M249A2 Sgt York fielded right about now, especially since the bugs found in testing would have been long since worked out of the system.

    At least at sea, the distances involved force the size of drones to be bigger, which is to say easier to track. I bet a SPY-2 radar emitter can do a wonder on a drone if they crank up the juice, too. Power is one thing those have lots of.

    1. Thanky! …US Army GENs in the Pentagram–puffed up with false pride–each posturing with the other showing off their “chest candy.” Perfumed Princes.

      Have neglected EW…to the grunts’ detriment.

  13. You know that Russian map. Well those official RU battlefield maps have not changed since May. Same one every day on RU state TV. Yet lots of verified OS intel photos / sat data etc showing UA position 30km to 50km south of those lines drawn on the RU maps.

    Yesterday’s map

    ..around 07:31 spot in

    Same area map back back at the end of May

    ..around 10:51 spot, same map, same lines, different little explosion graphics. But now with a big lake. I wonder where that went.

    I watch the Western MSM to see what lies they are telling. I watch the Russian State TV channels to see what lies they are telling.

    As for whats going on in Zaporizhzhia and Kherson Oblast the last few months. A rerun of the Kharkiv front last year. Or the early part of 1918 on the Western Front before the 100 Days really kicked off. This is trench warfare after all. Not a lot happens, then a lot happens.

    The talking heads on RU state media made a huge deal back in April and May about being in Odessa before the end of the summer. And recapturing Kherson (which was now officially part of Russia). And Kharkiv as well. Do any of your RU sources talk about what happened to this years promised Russian “Great Summer Offensive”? Guess not.

    I see T-55’s have started appearing in Oryx. Thats the bottom of the barrel. And we now know that a Challenger cannot survive a direct hit from a 152mm shell. Who would have thunk.

    Another day. Another pile of lies to plow through.

    B.T.W Ever read the John Mosby “Reluctant Partisan” books. He seems like your kind of guy. With the same sense of humor. And brutal honesty about what kind of shit will get you killed. Which is pretty much everything written in every other book on the subject.

  14. “That’s the Grin of a Lucky far Thinner Motherfucker…”

    No offence intended. And by all means take this as well intentioned

    I lost a stack of weight by using MY FITNESS PAL to track the calories I was consuming, weighed myself every day to keep myself honest (not upset by daily measurements but it’s the general direction), got myself a fitness tracker (just as another yard stick to go by) and I did meal replacement using protein shakes.

    Doing that I managed to lose 20% of my weight.

    Sure I get that my American Frens are fatty fat fats which is cool with me if that’s what you’re happy with.

    I just wanted to share what has worked for me. I also walk at least 10,000 steps a day. sometimes 18,000. But never less than 10k

    Anyway. Keep up the great work

    1. I walk a minimum 10,000 steps per day also. For awhile there I was walking several hundred yards of that backwards. It really worked out unused muscle. Then one day it blew out my Achilles. You may get the urge to try the backward walk but don’t do it. It’s not worth it.

    1. EIB Expert Infantry Badge. Never earned a CIB (bummer!) All my Combat Experiences were as a civvie or ‘other’ that doesn’t rate unfortunately.

  15. Another direction to consider for the future of drones is the Hammer’s Slammers series. Written by David Drake, who served with the 11th cav Blackhorse in nam with Pattons and those crazy ass M113 gun tracks.

    In that world, sensor tech and good line of sight weapons (he uses plasma, but laser will work well enough) means that nothing over the horizon survives. I think we are going there with drones, since they have been shown to be so effective. Once it is this dominating, the drive to overcome it can’t stay locked down, so someone will come up with a laser truck that has shit tons of sensors and has the job of lazing anything it sees. We are already going that direction for arty defense anyways.

    Sure gonna suck on the ground until that happens, though.

  16. Dammit, dude! Why the fuck didn’t you hit me up on da text and let me know that you were ranting again!?!?

    No way in Hades could anyone get me inside any kind of tin can in a real shootin’ war. Might as well paint a big “Insert Round Here” on your ass with today’s all-seeing weapons systems.

  17. As an aside, your mention of not killing a guy while on the shitter reminded me of a story I was told. Guy was a sniper in VN during the unpleasantness. Liked to get out and set up before dawn to catch the VC coming home from work. He was in position when he spotted a likely target, carrying an AK. As he zoomed in on him, the guy took off his gear, sat down next to a tree, and started eating his breakfast. Our guy said he wasn’t in any hurry, so he let him finish. When he did, he leaned back and lit up a cigarette. Took a few puffs and closed his eyes. That’s when he got popped. He said it was a favor, one grunt to another. Never forgot that story.

  18. People scoff at the Japs for drawing all those big robots and power armor and thye say “why would anyone USE that kind of stuff militarily”?

    Well now you have your answer.

    Tanks carry 3 or 4 guys and they are vulnerable to modern drone threats. In order to reduce this threat, you shrink the number of guys needed to operate the vehicles. Which means you shrink the vehicles and compensate for the reduction in carrying capacity by increasing the numbers of them.

    Infantry are far more vulnerable to drone threats so to compensate you must increase their armored protection. It reduces the number of men on the field in a given unit, but they gain additional firepower and mobility.

    So you have two lines converging into mechanized robotic suits that have lots of armor and increased firepower. Give them a bigger armored carrier that can protect itself from mines to drop them off and there you have it….


  19. @JimmyPx
    The machine gun – WWI troops quickly learned the futility of charging into a crew served machine gun

    I read on a now defunct site (, it mentioned that the commanding General of the Japanese Nogi Maresuke was described as “The last Samurai”, who lost his sons in this fight.) that this happened a lot earlier.
    During the 1904/1905 war between Russia and Japan the Japanese stormed Russian positions protected by barbed wire and machine guns. The japanese bodies were stacked three bodies high. There were even European observers on both sides of the war, but they didnt learn.

    And I agree with those that say that – normally – an army would look what happened and then decides to find out how to take away the advantage of the enemy.
    War is is a game of learning and evolving. If you do not learn or evolve, you die.
    (Yes, I know I was never in a war – so you all are in a far superior position – and just did my time of 15 month in the german air force but I still read and try to learn.)

  20. According to my extensive research (reading and watching a lot of sci-fi), the solution to too much tech cluttering up the story line is more tech which negates that tech, requiring a return to low-tech solutions. e.g., shields in Dune leading to a return to melee combat including knife fights.

    The strength of drones is that they are floating around in the sky; the weakness of drones is that they are floating around in the sky.

    So anti-drone drones + anti-drone ground equipment = infantry supremacy returned.

  21. Here’s a thought……anti-drone drones.

    Small, disposable drones in Infantry units. I assume they could kajiggered to attack other flying objects.

    Benning Schools for Boys. ‘83

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