Greetings Me Droogs N Droogettes!
Per Concerned American over at WRSA, he suggested that I do up a s.s. (substack) on how to try to effectively deal with a Patrol of Infantry in the odd occurrence of having to deal with “troops in the open” so to speak. I dropped it there, but quite a few folks don’t “do” substack, so I’m dropping it here as well. (Re-reading it, personally, I think it’s one of my best in a while)
Now, not for nothing, it’s a tough row to hoe so to speak.
Using what -I- lern’t back as a Green Grunt, there’s a few things that need to be kept in mind, especially in light of what exactly we’re lern’in about in the Krain.
One thing that’s completely and utterly changed the nature of Infantry warfare is DRONES. I’ve never had my asshole -clench- up so much as watching the vidyas of a single small loitering drone dropping a small bomb on some unsuspecting grunt in a trench.
Shit just didn’t exist back in the day, Thank God.
Case in point: Drones Killing Grunts
As well as the “playtime” drone vidya with Brandon Herrera and Garand Thumb: This Made My Asshole PUCKER
To the point for fun, there’s a $40 mini-drone on the ‘Zon that Sapper and I bought that we started fucking around with, which will be a poast on the blegg (or here) in the near-future. $35 plus shipping. It’s teeny, but hey… might have some reviews later as man, fucking around with a drone has taught me a few new tricks… specifically that drones are the new wave of anti-infantry tactics in the future.
Mind you, this’s an itty-bitty toy
BUT
IF finances were available, (the drone in question is like $2k) then it’d be much more ‘potentially lethal’ in that it could possibly carry a lethal payload, which is something ‘reg’lar folks’ like us who may-or-may-not be up against “Regime Forces” in the future to keep in mind.
Lord knows they’ll sure AF be using their drones against us.
BUT
That being said, let’s break it down like Barney, shall we?
The “Modern Infantry Squad” is now ‘broken down’ into a 9 man sized element that can fit in a Mechanized vehicle, either in one or two, dependent on the makeup of the higher unit elements, i.e. IF the squad is part of a “pure Infantry” element, like part of the 10th Infantry (Mountain) Division, then they tend to lean in more towards a non-mechanized grouping.
HOWEVER
As the world has gotten past the majority of “pure Infantry” (i.e. you walk and road-march and patrol EVERY via LPCs (leather personnel carriers, known as “boots” to regular folks) the reality is that even the Infantry has gone mechanized, either by Stryker Brigades, which utilize the M1126 Stryker Infantry Carrier Vehicle. It can carry a 9 Man Infantry squad internally, and is supported by either a 40mm Automatic Grenade Launcher or Browning M2A1 .50 Cal machine gun mounted on the roof turret.
Now, IMO, the Stryker is a piece of overly-complicated piece of mechanical shit. I saw faaaaaar too many of them returned to Kuwait while working the GMASS contract coming back with blown trannies and engines, and electrical issues. NOT a popular vehicle with the grunts, never mind having rubber tires (easily shot out) and thin useless armor that burns…
Now, the Bradley does the same thing, meaning it’s a bit more mechanically reliable, BUT it suffers from the same under-armoring.
Both are made of a hybrid aluminum-magnesium armor, that once it catches fire, that’s all she wrote. Case in point:
Brads, when they start to burn tend to slag the fuck out.
The turret on that one? Melted right into the hull as you can see
Hell the hull itself is slagged onto the back deck…
So, in the case of this particular ‘mental wargame’, keep it in mind that IF you can hit them when they are still ‘buttoned up’ inside the track, then you’re two steps ahead of them, as man, those fuckers burn baby. Better IF you can, to hit them whilst ‘buttoned up’ (meaning troops still inside) and as they, the troops try to panic-dismount as the track/truck is burning the fuck up, you can far more easily pick them off by onesies-twosies.
Jes’ Sayin’
So…
Now… say they DO manage to make it into the area of operations you’ve been sneaking and creeping in… Odds are, well, it’s NOT going to be A squad of dismounts. It’ll be much, much more, along with support in the ‘background, i.e. drones, AH-64 gunships and/or Fast Movers like the A-10 CAS (Close Air Support) or F-18s.
IF you hear jets, call it a day. Until such time as you’ve captured significant ADA (Air Defense Arty, AKA Stingers) you are purely fucked.
Now, an Infantry squad… the make-up of it looks like this:
Let’s say for THIS instance, you got ONE Infantry Squad who was close by.
You got the Squad Leader, Two Team Leaders, Two Grenadiers (now armed more than likely with the H&K M320 40mm launcher) Two pure Riflemen (privates more than likely, the new guys so to speak, more on that in a few) and Two Light Machine Gunners, running M249s, although I have seen the integration on an M240B in an new ergonomic squad… YMMV.
Now… let’s just say You as the OPFOR (Opposing Force). You got three guys. Two Bolt Action Deer rifles in 30-06, and One Bubba with a Converted AR-15, say 20in Barrel, with full-auto capability. You have 2 Molotov Cocktails available.
You, however, are on the home turf.
You hit a supply truck earlier. However, the QRF (Quick Reaction Force) managed to get ONE squad there, and you have them combing the woods for you, as they saw you and your bros via UNARMED drone and thermals. The drone couldn’t loiter, so the Squad has orders to search and destroy/capture if possible.
They’re in a standard file or staggered formation:
Or Staggered:
Now, the File is usually employed in a dense woodline, where they need to keep an eye on each other, lest someone get taken out. Standard Ranger File is a 5- to 10 meter spread, but that’s provided that they can keep visibility on each other.
The Staggered formation is usually on roads and hardball… one side of the line is on the left side of the road, and the other on right side, and depending on IF they get ambushed, then they maneuver as appropriately.
It also means that the team is not exposed in the centre of the danger area and can more easily reach cover and concealment on either side of the road.
Now… for OUR tactical sandbox exercise, lets say the ‘Regime Troops’ are following a wood trail… specifically one that YOU used, and that the drone spotted you on. It’s pretty dense, so 5-7 meters apart… They’ve broken into two elements, the first being in order of march:
Team Lead/Point Man
Grenadier/Radio Man
Rifleman
Machine Gunner
Then, the secondary part of the squad is on ‘trail’ (following behind)
Squad Leader (SSGt or higher) and his Radioman, who usually has a 40mm grenade launcher, as well as the Squad Radio.
This element is the two elements aforementioned elements, being made up of the Squad Leader and his Radioman, even though he (the Squad Leader) has (as well as the rest of the squad these days) his own short range communications via AN/PRC-152 Falcon 3 Handheld radios and headsets.
ID’d by a short whip antenna and usually chest mounted with either a handset or IF they’re hi-speed, a integrated headset.
Now, that being said, the Squad following outside of the Squad Leader and his Radioman, they’ll be in a rough approximation of the first part of the guys on the road march. Now… Yes, the Squad Leader is in command, and thereby dangerous.
HOWEVER
The most dangerous motherfucker out there?
The Squad Leader’s Radioman
That Radioman? He has a more powerful radio set, possibly the AN/PRC 158 Multi-Channel Manpack.
Notice the two larger antenna?
Critical Party Info:
That Guy Needs to be a Priority Target
Shoot his ass FIRST
”Why?” asks you?
Well, it’s because that fucking guy has the ability to multi-channel call for Artillery support, Aircraft support, and a LOT of other shit that can ‘bring the pain’ on you and your two buddies. When you hunker in, and get ready to “pull the trigger” THAT fucking guy needs one through his chest, and if it doesn’t fully go through him, you need to put another round through that fucking radio, otherwise you’re all fucking beans-on-toast. Not only that, but by dint of being the SL’s radioman, he knows how to call for fire on his own. The Squad Leader, yeah, he IS dangerous, but eliminate him from the ability to call for fire/support? He’s just another rifleman.
No Matter what, that dual-antenna guy, wherever he is in the formation?
You have got to kill him, and if not him, then the fucking radio.
So, In priority of targeting:
The Radioman with LOTS of Antennas
Then
The Machine Gunners.
You need to make sure your merry men, all three of you have the ability to survive this encounter. If the Machine Gunners ‘get it on’ and start doing a massive suppressive fire thing, you just might be in trouble. My advice, as “rambo-ish” as it sounds is have the AR guy hit the radio man as an opener, and HOSE Him the fuck down, especially to make sure the radio is fucking wasted, and then, the two guys with 30-06 deer rifles hit the two machine gunners… in the machine guns themselves.
Dual Purpose.
Sounds stupid, but roll with me here.
Infantry Machine Gunners tend to carry the weapons low… below the body armor and at crotch level….(see where I’m going with this?)
IF you have two guys who’ve been hunting deer their entire lives, and they’re madly proficient in using their 30 aughts, then having them aim for and hit the M249s or M240s only makes good sense.
- It’s going to destroy and/or disable the weapons
- The round, being a .30 aught, is probably going to cut right on through the weapon, and totally disable/wound and/or possibly kill the gunner.
- The disabled gunners, who were carrying the now-kaput weapons, well… all that shrapnel and bullet pieces more than likely hit them in the balls and dick, which is going to ADD to the chaos… I know I’d be screaming like a bitch if my junk got blow’d da fuq up… Jes’ Sayin’….
- Win-Win IMO
So.. You’ve wasted the Radioman with contact with Higher-Higher
This’s a good thing
Then you’ve eliminated not only the machine guns, but the gunners, who’re probably screaming ‘cos that kind of wound is usually crotch high as where the M249/M240 tend to sit when you’re carrying them.
You now have a Squad Leader, two Grenadiers and two probably noob Riflemen left. The Noobs are more than likely (and I’ve seen it IRL) panic and start dumping mags like a motherfucker…. Not a bad thing, IF you stay low… it means they’re going to be out of ammo mucho pronto.
Next job, if possible is to shoot the Squad Leader. They tend to be the guys pointing, yelling and generally being obvious in a situation like this, trying to get control of an out-of-control clusterfuck, which is why generally, they have a short lifespan in combat.
”Follow Me! I am Infantry” will getcha kil’t every. single. time.
Best Bet at this point IF you get fortunate enough to either kill/wound the squad leader is drop the two Molotov Cocktails in the mix. Fire causes chaos… Light ‘em, throw them, and be prepared to have to shoot them as well, as IF they don’t hit a rock, they’re not going to break… either way, as soon as you get a chance, you need to do the “bug-out boogie” ‘cos unless yer deep in friendly territory, you can for certain that the Cavalry is on it’s way.
Run away to fight another day.
But hey… hopefully this gives you some insight as to what you have to factor in.
MOST IMPORTANTLY
No matter what, the enemy is, for the most part ALWAYS going to have better support (initially) Better communications (initially) Better fire support and/or aviation assets, as well as observational abilities, i.e. the aforementioned drones.
All that taken into account, you can still kick the shit out of the Regime Troops IF you THINK.
Ask the fucking Afghans and Iraqis, as well as the Irish (h/t Art Sido) how it worked out for them.
More Later
Big Country
I was thinking when you got to Gen Molotov that it was elbows and assholes time. They have, likely, either two casualties and a KIA, or three casualties. Either way, out of the 5 men still on their feet, at least 2, prob 3-4 of them are stuck rendering aid and not fighting. Not only that, that rendering of aid is panicked, because with the RTO out, they have fuck all idea how to actually radio in the MEDIVAC. Smoke signals, I guess.
I doubt the SL is even worried about counterattack at that point, especially if you break contact. He’s trying to figure out how to keep the red stuff in the leaky meat sacks and how to hump 400 pounds of screaming pain to an aid station.
I wouldn’t bet my life on it, though, especially if you got 3 KIAs instead of one. Keep your head up while you run.
Good job bro.
Use a lot of caution with the molotovs. They’re a bitch to carry safely and at least in my neck of the woods that fire can spread damn quick. You can screw a lot of peoples lives up who might have otherwise given you material support until their home and garden got torched.
Ymmv
Comments from a little bit older grunt ( 80s, light infantry divisions, RB , ABN )
Good intel on the updated gear and thinking. Here’s my two cents…….
The scenario above is playing out here in the US. It doesn’t matter if it’s deep in the woods or MOUT / CQB or whatever they call it these days, but every swinging dick is going to have a cell phone on them. Dropping the RTO first is exactly right, but that doesn’t completely cut the lines of communication.
You nailed it with last bit. Shoot & scoot. I’d add blend in and be the gray man too, if you can. Don’t forget to liberate as much gear as possible from whomever gets smoked, if the opportunity arises.
Let’s hope it doesn’t come to fruition. I’m getting too old for this shit. But that doesn’t mean I won’t be balls deep in it, with a big grin on my face.
back in the 1970’s the IRA drove the brits mad with the one shot and gone way of doing things.
most had a dump spot for the weapon and the shooter hide in plain sight / blend in with the people
crying and running away like. there are a few squirrel hunters up this way that use 22 rifles
wouldn’t take much to train them up. I got picked for recon because of that skill back when I was in the 101st. anyway. you right about drones, they change everything. eyes in the sky shit.
Winchester makes and sells a 3.5 inch 12 gauge round with number 4 buckshot in it. 54 pellets.
I figure that with a good 28 inch barrel might work on some drones ? again it would depend on how high the damn thing is. but if you going to be hitting trucks and troops, you better have a few IEDs to
help things along. homemade claymores are not that hard to make really.
come to think about it, maybe a few 10-12 inch lengths of steel pipe with a round like above in them with a electric primer in them just might be doable . set them up to cover the trail like ?
might be something to think about ? and like most of you, I am way too old to running and gunning
like a young buck. but I can teach the boys a few tricks from back then.
We’ve had this battle with Aesop ad nauseum, BC. That little Mavik clone you guys are looking at might do for basic surveillance work. If you want to drop ordnance…you will need heavy lift to carry a meaningful payload. I’d recommend an octoquad, scratch built. I’ll tell you right up front…this is NOT the weapon you want to attack trained squaddies with. The ordnance carrying hobby drone as a weapon of war is a fake narrative right up there with the Ukrainian hotties that were going to turn the Russians back with AK47s. Or the Ghost Of Keev.
Warefare has changed. Most Ukrainians get wasted long before even seeing a Russian. In your hypothetical tactics discussion…chances are you’ll be spotted by a drone before you get anywhere close enough to the squaddies to start swapping bullets. You’ll probably get wasted by stand off weapons before you get close enough to be a threat. As I understand it, the Russians are using integrated warfare tactics that are even better than those of the US military. The experts I listen to are shitting bricks about it too. They’re screaming bloody murder that they should be studying the Russkie’s methods – but they are too focused on gay pride and rainbow coloured dildoes to bother. That may be actually work in the patriot’s favour…if the military becomes infested with gays, women, and low-IQ vibrants… the odds will be evened out a bit, maybe?
The new doctrine on the battlefield is now that you assume you are ALWAYS under surveillance, that you will NEVER have the element of surprise.
Another new development: rudimentary AI is now everywhere. Anyone can deepfake anything. I can generate passable vids of General Aesop fornicating with a duck and it will look legit. We no longer can trust anything we see or hear from anyone. Fact checking now is more crucial than ever before. We must now assume all Intel we have is flawed until proven correct.
It’s a different world, with different adversaries with different tactics.
Nice of the World’s Foremost Expert On Drones (because he once played with one) to step right up on his dick, over a year into the war in Ukraine, and tell BCE (and everyone else) not to believe their lying eyes about what COTS drones can and cannot do.
DJI Mavic 3 payload: up to 4.5 kg. (That’s nearly 10 pounds, for Common Core grads.)
https://ts2.space/en/the-dji-mavic-3-and-its-customizable-payload-configurations/
Weight of current-issue VOG-30 grenade: 0.35 kg (350 grams)
https://kintex.bg/product-4-242
That puts the payload at up to a dozen VOG-30 grenades, depending on how heavy the payload release device(s) is/are. Six or eight grenades? Once again, no sweat.
And lighter-payload earlier gen MAVICs could carry 500 grams, making them easily capable of dropping solo grenade rounds.
Glen, yet again, is five to ten years behind reality, and still screaming that the whole world should stop, because what’s been happening every day for over 16 months, and seen on 1000 YouTube videos, is unpossible according to him.
And the videos are obviously fake, he claims, because they disagree with The Mouth From The Great White North.
(“It was the videos that proved that the whole world was against me.” – Captain Filthie, The Drone Mutiny)
This is why you’re one-of-a-kind, Glen.
Most people get off their own dicks after the first stomp.
Only you would cleat up, and go for a four-year run.
You’re your own best advertisement for why no one should ever listen to you, except as comedy relief.
Any other reason is a distant second.
And you probably owe Warner Brothers royalty fees for stealing The Three Stooges’ schtick.
But even Moe didn’t poke himself in his own eyes, every single time.
Stay classy, man.
A stop molesting ducks.
Grunt here, same vintage as Loaded for bear. Still got the will, just ain’t got the legs or back, or wind, or eyes. But I can load mags with the best of’em. Also get an recalcitrant AR running again, so don’t discount us old timers. As in the movie The Postman when he asks the old Nam vet he replies “I know stuff”!
Been wondering if shotguns should be part of the TO&E these days. Say a long barrel 12 gauge w/ 3-3.5 inch goose loads for them flying eyeballs. I’d like ole Big Countries 2 cents on this.
Never underestimate the sheer fun of sprinkling fake IEDs all around your egress points. Bonus if some aren’t fake.
As usual, gloves, masks, wipe the outside with acetone or other degreaser to remove fingerprints and DNA.
Weird little totems or other not-normal things, like dolls hanging in trees and other weird shit, will put the infantry or dismounts into a weird vibe moment. Think any teen horror movie or “Blair Witch” type movie. Weird shit. A tree-stump covered in half burnt candles. Some Santa Malverda ‘prayer’ candles, Hispo Day of the Dead stuff. You know, shit that shouldn’t be there.
Never underestimate the ‘Some Ting Wong’ effect.
Even old trail cameras splattered about. They don’t have to work, just to be there.
Then there are countermeasures that you can take. Caltrops. Milk jugs full of nails with a Tannerite middle. Wires strung along walkways. Tiger pits. Punjee traps.
How to capture pesky drones? Get some bird nets and string them up above head height on your trails.
And you can use Big Army’s own technical manuals against them.
Make sure you sanitize. Sanitize your purchases. Sanitize your shooting positions. Police your brass (if you can.) Cover your mitts. Cover your mouth and nose. And be The Grey Man as much as possible. SSS counts also, as the death of most insurgent movements is squealers from within (so well portrayed in the original “Red Dawn.”)
Ooh… I like the way you think…
Thanks. Being picked on as a kid gives you lots of time to think of evil things to do to the people around you. Like, had a pro-version of a 10 speed with the clamps for an air pump. Put a length of broom handle in there to shove into the spokes of assholes who were bothering me.
And, seriously, anyone watching good 80’s movies has a stash of lots of little evil things to do.
Wanna fuck up mine or bomb detectors? Bury lots of old car rims. They’re even the right size for a good hole for an anti-tank or big anti-personnel mine. Smaller mines can be simulated for detectors by a can of rusty nails burried in the ground.
String a bunch of cans with rocks between trees. Shit like that.
Then there’s the Kelly Heroes move. Balloons of paint, fired using balloon sling shots (available from fine marine store establishments everywhere, or made from a large funnel and lots of stretchy materials like bungie cord or surgical tubing or even old bike innertubes) to splash occupation forces and their vehicles. Psychological warfare. And other things besides paint can be used. Piss. Poop. Shitty water, especially if left to stew and brew for a day or two. Blood, sugar water (especially in the South during summer, will attract huge numbers of flies and other insects.)
So many little things one can do.
Drones are pretty useless in my AO, and that’s where I have my line in the sand. Shit tons of dead ground covered in canopy make for good concealment, even from FLIR. 4 trained up fellas can sure fuck up another patrol that’s advancing to contact. I’m a third through reading ‘The White Pill’, and it will be much harder for the the commies this time round. Stay tiny but ultra deadly everyone!
Thanks, most useful for us ancient Chair Force, almost military, grunts.
Just read about a Montana gun shop that specializes in “fun guns” (AK&AR) that was raided at 8AM by “heavily” armed agents.
The only thing they took was the buyer’s information and it was IRS agents.
The article concludes with…and now you know what the 87,000 agents are for.
Some Grand Old Politburo Uniparty clown sent a sternly worded letter about defunding that was promptly laughed off as it was throw in the trash.
Thanks for this info of modern tactics, it was most useful and will probably come up again some day.
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2023/06/16/house-judiciary-committee-irs-agent-used-fake-identity-spoke-aggressively-to-taxpayer-during-house-visit
Thinking back to my long lost youth and such fun games as how many molotovs does it take to set a Pig on fire (answer at least 5 or 6 unless you get lucky) my mind turned to the old – Play Their Rules Against Them – game.
Now DotMIL seems to run by JAGS no matter how shooty the situation gets. Which naturally raises the question – how old do kids throwing stuff that will hurt you have to be before you can shoot them. The size of a 12 year old? A 14 years old? Bigger? Because when the situation goes seriously sideways you’d be surprised just how many 12 and 14 years are up for a bit of fun throwing stuff. Or just leaving stuff lying around. Stuff that can go bang in interesting ways. You know how kids are.
So maybe time to think like your local friendly neighborhood street dealer. Who do you get to do all the high profile running and delivering. Why the young ‘uns who the local Powers That Be won’t or can’t touch.
So a win-win situation for those fighting the Power. A very effective harassing force who the Other Side cant touch. And if the Other Side do something nasty against the under aged participants the Other Side will be in a world of hurt. One way or another. Either serious legal shit for Mr Trigger Happy(s). Or really piss off the 90% or so of the population who are the Dont Give A Fuck What Happens as Long As I Have My PornHub A/C masses.
Think Differently. As a very successful criminal psychopath once said.
Hope you have better luck with that $30 drone than I did. Spent hours trying to get it to fly stabilized, gave up. Spent more hours trying to get the iPhone app to connect to the drone, gave up. It’s on the way back to Amazon.