Greetings and Salutations!
Sorry for a bit of a prolonged absence. Been emotionally drained like you read about. Saturday Afternoon was Cowboy’s wife Kim’s Memorial Service. Gretchen and I both attended, and it was really really nice, with a LOT of people there and some good catered BBQ (great brisket BTW).
It was tough though.
Cowboy’s aged hard in the past two months. He said he’s doing OK but I worry. Purely hated seeing him all fucked up like that.
Takes a bit out of me yannow?
So Sunday was a mental health day. Which I extended into Monday as for whatever reason, I was completely mentally and I dunno? Spiritually? wiped out? I clocked into People’s Glorious Tractor Factory, but did the barest minimum to justify my hours for the day. Between the Commissar demands as of late, the abusive Clients, and just the overall “I’m not paid enough for this shit!” attitude that I’ve developed, well, all I can say is bring on the Sweet Meteor O’Death!
PLEASE
Even my minion is feeling the grind. Too much happening, not enough space to recover, working project to project, and having moar dumped on us on the regular. The new gig? I turned it down. Got word that damned near everything they had been telling me was bullshit. Glassdoor was very helpful in that regard.
So, on the Krainian side, Simplicius has a fascinating update regarding drone warfare. In that the Russians have started fielding Fiber Optic Guided Drones or FOG-D’s as I’ll refer to them here.
Seems that, depending on the size of the spool, they have upwards of a 5-10km (3-6 mile range) as the FO wire/cable ‘unspools’ behind the drone:
That, per the pic is a Kraut HMX drone.
Seems that FOG-Ds are not affected by Electronic Warfare. EW suites are designated and designed to block the radio signals on specific wavelengths to either ‘spoof’ the drone or ‘block the signal’ which renders it inoperative.
Also, in that there is no radio interference at all, the signal is faaaar crisper and cleaner if you will at the transmission/receiving end, as seen in this pic:
The link to the article and video is HERE
What I find interesting is that waaaay back in 1996 I heard about a program that the Army was looking into to replace my weapons system, the BGM-71B TOW, the Tube Launched Wire Guided Missile system:
THAT was my bread and butter back in the day. With the OLD thermal sight on top (waaaaay obsolete by todays standards).
There were whispers that the FOG-M or as it started being called in 1998, the EFOG-M was back on the table (1994/95) as a new weapons system designed to replace the TOW…. This was around the same time when I’d been told us 11-Hotels were on the ‘endangered MOS list’ so I dun went and lern’t whut I done could about this here new-fangled toy… got to stay ahead of the power curve Aye? Maybe get an early ‘place at the table’ right?
Originally, the base version, the Fiber Optic Guided Missile (FOG-M) was thought up in 1988, and was cancelled in 1990. Then around 1994, the DoD/Army put out a request to re-open the idea of a FO guided missile.
This was the EFOG-M or Enhanced FOG-M. They essentially took a standard TOW missile, specifically the motor, of a BGM-71 TOW missile, had a TV camera in the nose and a fiber-optic cable instead of the regular guiding wire that spooled out from the ass as it flew downrange. The Fiber Optic cable acted as a data link which transmitted the camera’s image to the gunner (hopefully moi), who could then send commands to the missile to the target.
It also was a vertical launch system as seem by the few pics of it:
It had the ability to pack 8!!! missiles on one vehicle which was designated the XM-44. The range was an insane 15km (9.3 miles!) and could be fired from a full defilade! That means they could dig a deep hole, and fire it out-of-sight-out-of-mind, and still plaster enemy targets. It also had ‘instant repeatability’ meaning the second you smoked ONE tank you could fire another missile and guide it in… The targeting system was NLOS (Non-Line-Of-Sight). It relied on a map overlay of where you were firing from w/GPS, and then the camera itself on the missile and the skill of the gunner to guide it in…
And as an ‘added plus’ it was a ‘top down killer’ which meant it came down from ‘on-high’ thru the roof of an MBT/APC where the armor purely sucks as we’ve seen oh so frequently in the Krain on both sides.
Considering the TOW only had an ‘official range’ of 3750m, or 2.3 miles, although I have heard <ahem ahem> of Really Good Gunners Hitting out at 4400m. Either way, at the time, the TOW looked like it was on it’s way out.
THEN ‘things’ happened.
Somehow the TOW got a second ‘lease on life’ and a newer sight system, as well as a new MGS (Missile Guidance System). The famous picture from the Narang Valley in Konar Province Afghanistan shows the latest and greatest variant of the M220 SABER TOW System:
Either way…
I’m sure money changed hands on many sides to keep the venerable TOW around despite the glaringly obvious advantages the EFOG-M has/had. Whomever made that decision should be killed out of hand.
After this and the ‘latest and greatest’?
They might be thinking/rethinking the idea…
The again, Meh…
Who am I shitting?
The DoD changing their ossified retard ways?
Never gonna happen Aye?
But the whole point to this is we’re seeing a generational jump in the past two years of Ground Warfare. Don’t want to get into the whole ‘who’s ackchully winning’ or ‘I don’t believe drones could carry those weights’ or any of the other stupid out there.
Fact of the matter is, the Azerbaijan vs Armenian war, or better known as the ‘Second Nagorno-Karabakh War’ drones played an integral part in spotting ‘troops in the open’ for both sides. I saw some of the earliest Drone Footage in that war and was truly horrified as to the whole “you can run, but you can’t hide” aspect of a Drone’s invasive observational capacity regarding scouting, and laying fire on troops/infantry. No need to have a Arty-Spotter… nope… just throw a Chineseum drone up, and let it sneak and peak at a distance, and bring the Hate.
First it was just Drones for Observational Capabilities. “We can see you!”
THEN it became “Hey we can mount an RPG Warhead on this and take out vehicles!”
After THAT, it was “Wow! We can drop grenades on dudes w/this!”
After a while it became “We have Swarms of AI Guided Flying Fucking Bombs. You can run, but you will only die tired Tovarisch!”
And as of late: “We have drones that even your most advanced Anti-Drone Tech cannot stop. Surrender now. Resistance is Futile.”
Being an ‘old Grunt’ from the ‘old school’ I’m fucking glad I’m out of that particular Infantry Based game now. In fact I’m doing, with Sapper some seriously pointed studies on Anti-Drone ‘stuff’ due to the extreme civilian/police/andd DotMil Proliferation.
This’s one Genie which ain’t going back in the Bottle any time soon. Hell, perusing the 3D Print pages, (quick aside: I need to finish getting my printer back up and running. It’s not broken per se… It’s that I got a newer design print head that I just haven’t had time to install. I got the fucker apart, but haven’t had the time to rebuild and install the new one. ) But yeah, the 3D pages these days are positively flooded with prop designs, body designs… you name it, Drone-Wise, it’s out there, and the ‘functional parts’ are readily and cheaply available.
Make of it (literally!) What You Will.
So More Later
Big Country
Yea, we need a small automated AAA system that can put metal on the drone right freaking now, but as I’m sure you are aware, organic anti-air in Big Green has been severely lacking for a long time. Chaparral is retired, HAWK is retired, M163 is long gone, Sgt. York was killed on the verge of fielding, and who knows how many of those IM-SHORAD Stryker vehicles are going to be around. It is criminal that the US has nothing between Stinger and Patriot, and next to no mobile AAA at all.
Infantry needs something man portable with a quickness, but AFAIK no one is even looking at it.
Yeah, I thought about that and we need to get a micro CIWS up and running using audio, video, and GHZ fire control radar mated with a micro SLQ32 and AI automation. Would be man portable like the autocannon in Aliens. Could be mounted on all sorts of platforms. Might have laser, DEW, and EW capability also. Yeaaaah and I’m a chinese fighter pilot.
I remember seeing a piece about a ballistic computer/laser rangefinder/AI pattern recognition sight for rifles. You center a moving target on the recognition phase and try to keep the gun on target. When the ballistics, range and target line up – bang. It was 5-6 years ago. Would be great for jackrabbits or drones.
From a different approach, there are plans for compressed air golf ball cannons out there. Remember, from deep in a dark room is the place to shoot.
Counter drone? You have chosen wisely.
Keep morale up by any means necessary.
The time of making good commies will be glorious.
Love to hear more about the counter-drones TTP.
A fellow Tampa Bay area reader.
The horror of mini sauron eyes everywhere has preyed on my steenky old infantry insect brain for some time now. Some ideas:
An infantry weapon sight using lidar and pattern recognition, with an electromechanical trigger interface. Just clamp it on a standard weapon, scan for target or be cued in by a local network, delegate firing authority by pressing the overlaid trigger, the system then calculates range and deflection and guides the soldier to elevate/traverse and the system fires when the target is in the pK box.
A stand-alone detector, again using lidar, and networked with other nodes by laser modem. No em emissions! Yes, the lasers will then become the weakpoint as far as counterdetection and targeting, but frequency agility, and simply flooding the area with laser decoys will make a haystack to hide in.
Airborne hunter killer drone swarms, again using lidar and networked laser modems. Onboard armament simply stripped down standard infantry small arms, with a linkless ammunition feed. Powered by two/stroke-electric system for long loiter time and high dash speeds. Ai swarm capability, a cloud of air superiority over friendly lines. Special ammunition could be supplied, using the THV/Monad system with light HE projectiles with short range and tracer self destruct. Of course some scoundrels will try and use the special ammo on humans, a warcrime, punishable by being hosed down from the feet up with the same ammo.
Variations on the above for vehicle mounts…
https://www.instructables.com/Raspberry-Pi-Motion-Tracking-Airsoft-Turret/
https://www.instructables.com/Autonomous-Nerf-Sentry-Turret/
Combine the two for motion tracking and LIDAR, switch out the NERF gun for a Calico in 22LR or 9mm (100 round magazines and simple design), mount where needed.
Up here in Canada we have snow snakes. Antifreeze in their blood allows them thrive in arctic environments and they are ruthless predators. They can grab full grown squaddies while they’re sleeping in their fart sacks – and carry them off and devour them. They hunt at night. Global warming has forced them to adapt to warmer climes…don’t be surprised if you see them in Florida soon…
Jeebus, Tiny, you’re as bad as General Aesop. You girls get hold of psyop bullshit and scare yourselves to death with it. Guys like you two are the best asset the PR wanks have in the military/industrial complex. I should seriously get in on this racket. Tell a few rubes some ghost stories … and cash in! FO drones? Why not? Duct tape a closed face fishing reel to a chit house drone, show the mock up to the rubes… and they’ll fall over themselves gobbling in fright and will throw money at you! Drones are slow moving antennae farms, but ya know what’d fix ‘em? Fibre optic telemetry!!!
😂😂😂
Think, Tiny. Four whirling rotors. Ultralight FO filament. High winds. This is “screen doors on submarines” level of silliness. Just looking at this ridiculous thing… can’t tell if that’s actually FO cable or Shimano two pound ultralight test… but there’s no way that reel holds ten km on it…
But whatever. Enjoy the fear porn, fellas. I’m sure our buddies at Raytheon will have a viable defence soon!
Those Snow Snakes are a Hazard there around Vancouver.
https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjIsALYLEcXJCH9yYNReYfIvKySx3a1iiDphuOAYkvXnUOBRTuM-Cz8xc1m_sJfE2lM11x3mKOske1KPmyGJWskJJB5RvImtm6ktPjaaLcrQxNxOnShQcWK1WcpwJijaEC8WbMnoajpsvI/s1600/BattlestarBloodandChrome1220103-1.jpg
Filthie:
I had a team of engineering students design and build from off the shelf components an autonomous drone that could carry 5kg for 15 minutes. It was autonomous in the sense that it was GPS signal driven to single or multiple global coordinates and then lidar and IR final lock to target. It did not need a targeting signal from an operator after launch but could send video back if required. Set and forget for good shoot and scoot capability. The real limit was the battery life and energy density per kg of mass. This was done for under a $2k budget.
Spin
PS: Never piss off a former DOD contract weapons engineer with a bad attitude.
Not doubting you, S. I could do it myself if someone else were paying for it. And really, viable GPS/waypoint capabilities have been around for at least 8 years. In an urban environment in a bomber/attack role, your autonomous drone is going to need a full sensor suite and avionics to sense obstructions and evade/avoid them. You aren’t doing that for $2k my friend.
Think, you guys! If winning the war in the Kraine is as easy as duct-taping explosives to chit house drones… why aren’t we winning? Why aren’t the Israelis using them? Or the Arabs?
Actually dude, BOTH the Ay-Rabs AND The Hebes are BOTH using drones. I’ll look for the vidya, but part of what made Oct 5th? 7th? Whatever so successfull was the Bad Guys dropped frags into the autonomous .50cal Towers that they had on the border. Stop being a Boomer-Pedant when it comes to this stuff… “If -I-/my frens haven’t done it, then it’s Unpossible!!!” And in this case the US isn’t fielding shit for drones… despite the few articles out there, I worked EXTENSIVELY with the guys, both in Iraq and Affy supporting them as they utilized a lot of our VSAT gear.
Plus we’re NEVER going to win. Not against Russia. 10 times our size, 40x our DotMil capabilities and 100% into ‘it to win it’ if you will.
Like I said, stop being a Boomer-Pedant.
The autoflight-avionics component was $350. Avoidance and recovery baked in, sensing is by 360 lidar. Scary capabilities but was figured out for amazon pkg delivery system. Other uses are up to the imagination.
Spin
P. S. I wonder how heavy BCE’s flamenwoofer is?
If I were a soldier in a combat zone, drones would scare the shit out of me because they seem to catch guys unawares all the time. Bad enough having some dude shooting at you but a drone that blows up your tank without you even seeing it coming? Screw that. I do know that while our military is all about trannies and wahmen in power, the Russians are reinventing warfare. That doesn’t bode well for a shooting war should one take place.
The two bit drone is a bogeyman. If you actually built and flew quad rotors as I have – you’d see this BS for the hogwash it is. If the Russians want to kill you, they use good old fashioned artillery – for the most part. Missiles and rockets take a smaller toll on ground forces, then mines, then full ape-on-ape combat. Weaponized drones are a psyop to keep you from sleeping at night and fearful during the day.
What’s the lethal radius of a hand grenade, guys? 10 -15 yards? What’s the range on a 12 bore stoked with magnum BB rounds? 60? Boom – instant, effective anti drone weaponry. These things are not game changers beyond surveillance and spotting for the artillery.
That is bad enough. Crawl out of your funky cellar and try to be invisible and effective amongst the bushes like infantry used to be able to. And maybe folks with bigger budgets and unhindered access to better hardware than you are actually as dangerous as napkin math suggests.
I am a qualified commercial RPAS pilot – no big deal – I took a course, passed a test and now am allowed to fly DJI Mavics and Phantom 4’s for work. Meh. The only reason I bring this up is because one of my instructors worked on a case where a young girl was abducted by an aboriginal fella in Western Australia. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abduction_of_Cleo_Smith . The police knew who had her, but couldn’t prove it, so put a tethered UAV, powered by 240 volts 24/7 and watched him from around 10 km away using this drone until he went to the girl. They followed and caught him red-handed. This was never public disclosed. I’m a shit-kicker nobody and heard about it, didn’t believe it so started googling and was gobsmacked by what I found.
I agree that what BCE etal are talking about sounds like bull-sheet0. Eastern philosophy & Cowboy movies – yin, yang and the “bang-bang” – but the tech at the commercial bleeding edge is unbelievably good. We now have deer hunters and commercial vertebrate pest control contractors using $8,000 AUD thermally equipped Mavics. Imagine just how good _some_ of the mil-spec stuff must be now. Way way way better than the COTS stuff the average civvie gets to see. Not saying panic like a headless chook – rather the truth probably lies somewhere in the middle. The “Buck Rogers” tech has a nasty habit of being really temperamental and finnicky. I’m sure some of the military goodies would be the same – but I don’t know because I’m just a civvie.
Your summary of drone use progression reminded me of the same for hot air balloon, early plane and onwards in war usage. US MIC will be the only one with multi million dollar drones (each) following the airplane progression.
I think the VC might have been onto something with the tunneling.
Investment in audio reecog and nets and silly string!
Another option which I have watched on You Tube is using 12 or 10 gauge 3 or 3 1/2-inch shells in an old school 30″-barrel goose gun. Using #4 shot, the shooters were able to plaster a target out to 100 yards. I have not tried to imitate this yet, but I will make time to get to the range and report back. Stay tuned.
My old M-40 106mm recoilless rifle with beehive would make a great long range shotgun. I remember setting the fuse for the range and it blew the casing at a pre-set distance before the target, so it got full blast on target.
We shot them out of the 105mm main gun on the M-60A1 also. After driving thru the impact area, we dismounted and I picked up a few, nasty little things. Canister shot from a black powder cannon isn’t obsolete if it works.
If and when all this new electronic shit goes down, old school will rule. That includes learning your compass work, instead of relying on a GPS.
Interesting read! During the period you mention ’84 – ’95, I was peripherally involved in the events covered. Thought FOG-M was a grand idea. Too low on the totem pole for my opinion to have an effect. Regards one of Filthie’s critques, the air flow from a drome prop flows downward from the top of the vehicle. The cable goes downward out of the back of the vehicle. Not a lot of chance for the cable to wind up in a prop.
You’ve never actually used a drone nor monofilament.
If you had you wouldn’t have written the silly thing you did.
The EA video game Battlefield 2042 had a mercenary named Casper who you could play as. Casper was a scout armed with a drone. The drone could spot enemy troops and blind vehicles with EMP. When the game first started, Casper had the option to use C4. Enterprising players discovered you could attach C4 to the drone and land it on tanks or behind enemy troops then hit the clicker and boom.
Unfortunately EA decided to take C4 away from the scout class and playing as Casper isn’t as fun.
I cry under my welding just like everybody else
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_XwhwE_rfLw&pp=ygUbSSBjcnkgdW5kZXIgbXkgd2VsZGluZyBob29k
Seems to me the fiber-optic cable is the weak link. Sever it, and drone is (potentially) unguided and/or blind. Worst case it either ‘returns to base’ (worse for ‘them’, it shows us where to target), or it degrades to earlier radio comms – which are jammable.
So – anybody had any luck rigging up a 12ga (or larger) shell that has a ‘bolo’ style projectile, or a ‘net’ projectile that can either snag/break the cable, or drop the drone via ‘wrapping it up’?
Inquiring minds want to know – for future reference, of course. 😉
If you spot it that close, it already has seen you. How fast can they go….what is your window of opportunity to destroy it before it or one of its buddies or some supersonic nastiness it called in smudges you into the landscape?
I know some great waterfowl hunters. They might average 10-20% on ducks, and that’s largely for birds which they are trying to CALL IN and at 40 yards range. If anybody thinks they’re going to be standing up and 12-gauging passing drones in some sort of live action video game, I want to be as far away from them as possible for when the incoming wipes them out.
Really, the common man, small groups gonna have access to this magic!,,,sure man.
While it’s all good dope, it’s simply not practical. I can’t carry it, won’t fit it my Royal Flyer kiddie cart, no thanks.
We are however snapping up all kinds of Drones off of Craigslist. It two is one, we want 100 for special projects. They’re used but mostly seem to work fine. We’ve learned spares are a plus!
Good stuff Biggy, inquiring minds need more better home based solutions, not the Amway scam.
Teach me how to more better hide from IR, AND what IR I should be looking to obtain?
Dirk
Watch some of the racing drones, 125+ mph flight abet for short haul and very light drone. Shot gun out to 100 yards blast radius 10 15 yards , just drop grenade from 110 yard up. Anyone heard of the bird size drone ,10 km range speed unknown but carried small explosive charge, capable of flying fight up to you or thru a window to blow you up. it is not so much question of if they exist or not , as it is , when will they be fielded?
When it comes to drones, our technology is very early days like planes in the early 19o0s (like the Wright Model A).
Now compare that to an F35. Drone technology in 50 years will be down right scary.
The scariest thing though is the day when computers have become small and light enough and the drone’s power source and lifting power high enough that some dumbass will say “hey, an AI onboard would be WAAAY better than a human operator. Voila, you now have Skynet.
Hopefully that’s a LOOONG time in the future before that happens.
Rasberry Pi anyone?
Spin